Ten Things that Change without Fossil Fuels

Getting your Trinity Audio player ready...

It is now popular to talk about leaving fossil fuels to prevent climate change. Pretty much the same result occurs if we run short of fossil fuels: We lose fossil fuels, but it is because we cannot extract them. Practically no one tells us about the extent to which the current system depends upon fossil fuels, however.

The economy is extraordinarily dependent on fossil fuels. If there are not enough fossil fuels to go around, there is likely to be fighting over what is available. Some countries are likely to get far more than their fair share, while the rest of the world’s population will be left with very little or no fossil fuels.

If losing fossil fuels completely, or nearly completely, is a risk for some of the world’s population, it might be useful to think through some of the things that go wrong. The following are some of my ideas about things that change, mostly for the worse, in a fossil fuel-deprived economy.

[1] Banks, as we know them, will likely fail.

Before banks fail in areas with virtually no fossil fuels, my guess is that we will generally see hyperinflation. Governments will greatly increase the money supply in a vain attempt to get people to believe that more goods and services are being produced. This approach will be used because people equate having more money with the ability to buy more goods and services. Unfortunately, without fossil fuels it will be very difficult to produce very many goods.

More money will simply provide more inflation because it takes physical resources, including the proper types of energy, to operate machinery of all kinds to make goods. Creating services also requires fossil fuel energy, but generally, to a lesser extent than creating goods. For example, the pair of scissors used in cutting hair is made using fossil fuel energy. The person cutting hair needs to be paid; his or her pay needs to be high enough to cover energy-related costs such as buying and cooking food to eat. The shop where hair cutting is operated will also need to pay for the fossil fuel energy required for heat and light, assuming such energy is even available.

Banks will fail because too large a share of debts cannot be repaid with interest. Part of the problem will be that while wages will rise, the prices of goods and services will rise even faster, making goods unaffordable. Another part of the problem is that service economies, such as those of the US and eurozone, will be disproportionately affected by a declining economy. In such an economy, people will get their hair cut less often. Instead, they will spend their money on essentials, including food, water, and cooking supplies. Service-providing businesses, such as hair salons and restaurants, will fail for lack of customers, leading to defaults on their debts.

[2] Today’s governments will fail.

With failing banks, today’s governments will also fail. Partly, they will fail because of attempts to bail out banks. Another problem will be declining tax revenue because fewer goods and services are produced. Pension programs will become increasingly difficult to fund. All these issues will lead to increasingly divisive politics. In some cases, central governments may dissolve, leaving states and other smaller units, such as today’s provinces, to continue on their own.

Intergovernmental organizations, such as the United Nations and NATO, will find their voices becoming less and less heeded before they fail. Getting sufficient funding from member states will become an increasing problem.

Dictatorships ruled by leaders who wield absolute power and aristocracies ruled by leaders with hereditary rights are the types of governments with the least energy requirements. These are likely to become more common without fossil fuels.

[3] Nearly all of today’s businesses will fail.

Fossil fuels are essential for all kinds of businesses. They are used in the extraction of raw materials and in the transportation of goods. We use fossil fuels to pave roads and to build nearly all of today’s buildings. Without fossil fuels, even simple repairs of existing infrastructure become impossible. Without adequate fossil fuels, international companies are especially at risk of breaking into smaller units. They will find it impossible to operate in parts of the world with virtually no fossil fuel supply.

Fossil fuels are even used in making solar panels, wind turbines, and replacement parts for electric vehicles. Talking about solar and wind as “renewables” is to a significant extent misleading. At best, they can be described as fossil fuel “extenders.” They might help a problem of a slightly low fossil fuel supply, but they are far from adequate substitutes.

[4] Grid electricity and the internet will disappear.

Fossil fuels are important for maintaining the electrical transmission system. For example, restoring downed power lines after storms requires fossil fuels. Hooking up solar panels or wind turbines to the electric grid requires fossil fuels. Home solar panel systems may operate until their inverters fail. Once their inverters fail, their usefulness will be greatly degraded. Fossil fuels are needed to manufacture new inverters.

Fossil fuels are also important for maintaining every part of the internet system. Furthermore, without grid electricity, it becomes impossible to use computers to connect to the internet.

[5] International trade will be scaled back greatly.

At this time of year, many of us remember the story of the three kings from the East coming to visit the baby Jesus with precious gifts. We also remember stories in the Bible of Paul traveling to distant countries. From these and many other examples, we know that international trade and travel can continue without fossil fuels.

The problem is that without fossil fuels, some parts of the world will have very little to offer in return for goods made with fossil fuels. Countries with fossil fuels will quickly figure out that government debt from countries without fossil fuels doesn’t really mean much when it comes to paying for goods and services. As a result, trade will be scaled back to match available exports. Exports of goods will likely be very limited for parts of the world operating without fossil fuels.

[6] Agriculture will become much less efficient.

Today’s agriculture has been made unbelievably efficient using large mechanical equipment, generally powered by diesel, together with a huge number of chemicals, including herbicides, insecticides, and fertilizers. In addition, fences and netting made with fossil fuels are used to keep out unwanted animal pests. In some cases, greenhouses are used to provide a controlled climate for plants. Using fossil fuels, specialized hybrid seeds are developed that emphasize characteristics that farmers consider desirable. All these “helps” will tend to disappear.

Without these helps, agriculture will become much less efficient. Figure 1 shows that even with the small cutback in fossil fuel use in 2020, the share of employment provided by agriculture rose.

Figure 1. World employment in agriculture as a percentage of total employment, as compiled by the World Bank.

Employment in agriculture is essential. These workers did not get laid off, even as workers in tourism and workers making fancy clothes lost their jobs, so agricultural jobs as a share of total employment rose.

[7] Future labor needs are likely to be disproportionately in the agricultural sector.

People need to eat. Even if the economy is operating in a very inefficient manner, people will need food. The share of people in agriculture (including hunting and gathering) can be expected to rise considerably.

Some people hope that a shift to the use of permaculture will solve the problem of the dependence of agriculture on fossil fuels. I see permaculture as mostly a fossil-fuel extender, rather than a solution for getting along without fossil fuels, because it assumes the use of many fossil fuel-based devices, such as modern fences and today’s tools. Also, at best, permaculture only partly solves the inefficiency problem because it requires a huge amount of hands-on labor.

Figure 2. Comparison of US employment in agriculture as a share of total employment, with a similar ratio for the UN Least Developed Countries based on data of the World Bank.

Today, there is a wide divide between the share of employment in agriculture in the United States and in the same statistic for the UN group of least developed countries. Most of these countries are in sub-Saharan Africa. They use very little fossil fuels.

The US share of employment in agriculture has recently been about 1.7%. In the part of Europe using the Euro, the share of employment in agriculture has recently averaged about 3.0%. In either the US or Europe, it would take a huge change in employment to get to 70% in agricultural employment (as seen early in the 1990s for the UN least developed group), or even to 55% (as experienced recently by the same group).

[8] Home heating will become a luxury item available only to the wealthy.

Without fossil fuels, wood will come into high demand for its heat value. Wood will be needed for cooking food; it is very difficult to subsist on a diet of all raw foods. Wood will also be in demand for making charcoal, which in turn can be used to smelt some metals. With these demands on wood, deforestation is likely to become a major problem in many parts of the world. Wood in general will be quite expensive, given the considerable cost of harvesting and transporting it over long distances without the benefit of fossil fuels.

People living in sparsely populated wooded areas may be able to gather their own wood for home heating. For other people, home heating will likely become a luxury, affordable only by the very rich.

[9] Living alone will become a thing of the past.

Without enough heat, and with barely enough wood for cooking, people (and their animals) will have to huddle together more. Homes housing multiple generations, built over a place for keeping farm animals, may again become popular. It will be more efficient to cook for large groups than for one person at a time. People in cold areas will huddle together with each other in beds to keep warm. Or they will huddle together with their dogs, as in the saying, three dog night, meaning a night that is cold enough to need to have three dogs to keep a person warm.

Even in warm parts of the world, people will live together in groups, simply because maintaining a household for a single person will become impossibly expensive. Food and fuel for cooking will take up a huge share of a family’s income. There will be little left over for other expenses.

[10] Governments and their laws will shrink in importance. Instead, new traditions and new religions will play a greater role in keeping order.

Governments have made dozens of promises, but without a growing supply of fossil fuels (or an adequate substitute), they will not be able to keep them. Pensions will be gone. The ability of governments to enforce ownership laws will likely disappear. Without any good substitute for fossil fuels, mass disorder is a likely outcome.

People crave order. Without order, it is impossible to conduct business. We know from recent experience that “sustainability groups,” put together by people with a common interest in sustainability tend not to work well enough to provide order. They tend to fall apart as soon as obstacles arise.

What has seemed to work to provide order in the past is some combination of traditions and religions. With a changing world, both traditions and religions are likely to need to change. In the book, Communities that Abide, by Dmitry Orlov et al., the authors point out that having a strong (non-elected) leader, and a shared set of religious beliefs, helps keep a group together. In fact, it helps if the group is somewhat persecuted. Fighting for a common cause is part of what keeps the group together.

The Ten Commandments in the Bible are interpreted in a way that strongly suggests that they are rules for behavior within the group, not for behavior in general. For example, “Thou shalt not kill,” applies to other members of the group; wars against other groups were very much expected. In those wars, killing of members of another group was expected. This would seem to allow Israel’s killing of members of Hamas, today. Without enough fossil fuels to go around, fighting becomes more frequent.

Conclusion

In my opinion, the problem the world is facing today is like one that smaller economies have faced, over and over, in the past: The population has become too large for the economy’s resource base, which now includes fossil fuels. Today’s leaders reframe the problem as voluntarily moving away from fossil fuels to prevent climate change in order to make the situation sound less frightening.

As I see the situation, the world needs to scale down its use of fossil fuels because, ultimately, the laws of physics determine selling prices for fossil fuels. We extract the inexpensive-to-produce fossil fuels first. The problem is that fossil fuel selling prices cannot rise arbitrarily high. Prices must be both:

  • High enough for producers to make a profit, with funds left over for reinvestment and for adequate taxes for their governments.
  • Low enough for consumers to afford to buy food and other consumer goods produced with these fossil fuels.

If we assume that all the fossil fuels that seem to be under the ground can really be extracted, climate change from burning them may indeed be a problem. But it is hard to see that they can really be extracted, given the affordability issue. Politicians will hold down prices to get voters to vote for them if nothing else.

Researchers have been working diligently to find solutions, but to date, their success has been poor. Every supposed solution requires significant use of fossil fuels. So, we need to think through what might happen if we are forced to get along without fossil fuels and without an adequate substitute.

About Gail Tverberg

My name is Gail Tverberg. I am an actuary interested in finite world issues - oil depletion, natural gas depletion, water shortages, and climate change. Oil limits look very different from what most expect, with high prices leading to recession, and low prices leading to financial problems for oil producers and for oil exporting countries. We are really dealing with a physics problem that affects many parts of the economy at once, including wages and the financial system. I try to look at the overall problem.
This entry was posted in Financial Implications, Food issues and tagged , , , . Bookmark the permalink.

3,384 Responses to Ten Things that Change without Fossil Fuels

    • With multiple boosters, antibodies become more tolerant of the spike protein. Instead of attacking it, they just let it run. So they don’t do their job.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        yes… yessssss….. and when they don’t do their job … and you introduce a pathogen designed to be ignored by the lazy no good for nuthin immune system… that is asleep… consider the outcome…

        Guess why geriatrics are at great risk of dying from respiratory diseases… I’ll tell ya’ll…

        Their immune systems are feeble and weak — and they no longer do their job… unlike the above scenario this is not a result of Acquiring Immune Deficiency via Injecting a Vaccine over and over (VAIDS as it’s called)…

        This is just the body gone past its use by date… the parts are no longer functioning… their p.iss dribbles out (see norm and the diapers)… they lack energy .. their skin is translucent …they have aging spots… you know that look — the look of Death is Near… and their immune system barely functions…

        Same with the VAIDSies only they brought it upon themselves cuz of their stooopidity and trusting of huffcnnbbc…

        Remember 2019 — we knew what could not continue was going to stop – and before that happened they unleashed covid and trillions upon trillions of $$$ of stimulus — followed by many billions of shots of Rat Juice…

        We very obviously in another of these moments… they can’t open the $$$ tap again…

        What else can they do?? You tell me… I think they are trapped.

        Therefore — the next act involves VAIDS + The Pathogen.

        Feel free to provide alternative endings

  1. Fast Eddy says:

    True right? Everything is true

    WEF’s ‘Net Zero’ Goals Will Kill ‘4+ Billion People,’ Experts Warn

    Leading experts have spoken out to warn the public that the World Economic Forum’s (WEF) “Net Zero” goal to eliminate fossil fuels will result in the deaths of over four billion people. As Slay News has reported, the WEF and its fellow unelected globalist organization, the United Nations (UN), are pushing for governments around the world to “phase out” fossil fuels.

    The “Net Zero” target to end fossil fuel use is part of the WEF and UN’s “Agenda 2030” and “Agenda 2050” plans for humanity.

    • Do you have a link for this?

      I am afraid “Net Zero” will kill more than 4 billion people. Running short of fossil fuels will have a similar effect.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        https://slaynews.com/news/wef-net-zero-goals-will-kill-4-billion-people-experts-warn/

        It is true but not the way they are saying of course

        And 8B die

          • Cromagnon says:

            Apologies but I don’t have a link.

            I would encourage you have a look at Bret Weinstein’s interview on “Before Skool”

            He posits that fake AI will rapidly remove what little remains of all trust in communication between humans now. It will destroy our ability to make organized decisions toward any common good……we become hopeless as a population just when we need competence the most.

            Almost like it was designed that way (my words…not his)

            • Kadmon says:

              Bret Weinstein Is not about truth although he proclaim himself to be; which according to the highest law; means he already has his reward.

              Note, he was reading from a script. He was installing fear and mistrust, the very systems of control TpTB use to wield us against each other. Think about it.

  2. Fast Eddy says:

    hahaha… sure they are… and we’ll all be flying around in Jetsons soon

    But hey – it’s in the news — must be true… right?

    Chinese military developing thought control weapons

    China‘s military is developing advanced psychological warfare and brain-influencing weapons as part of a new warfighting strategy, according to a report on People’s Liberation Army cognitive warfare.

    The report, “Warfare in the Cognitive Age: NeuroStrike and the PLA’s Advanced Psychological Weapons and Tactics,” was published earlier this month by The CCP Biothreats Initiative, a research group.

  3. Fast Eddy says:

    https://www.activistpost.com/2023/12/self-checkout-kiosks-at-4500-walmarts-now-offer-buy-now-pay-later-loans-for-basic-items.html

    “Buy now, pay later” (BNPL) loans surged in popularity during Black Friday and Cyber Monday in late November. As Christmas is less than a week away, Walmart shoppers have been greeted with a new BNPL payment at the checkout line. The increased use of BNPL is incredibly problematic for consumers with insurmountable credit card debt and depleted savings.

    Affirm Holdings announced Tuesday that its BNPL service has been expanded to self-checkout kiosks at 4,500 Walmart stores nationwide. Customers can purchase electronics, apparel, toys, and many more items (except groceries) by spreading payments out from three months to 24 months.

    “Recent Affirm research revealed that more than half of Americans (54%) are looking for retailers to offer a buy now, pay later option at checkout. Moreover, we’ve found that 76% of consumers would either delay or not make a purchase without Affirm,” said Pat Suh, Affirm’s SVP of Revenue.

  4. Fast Eddy says:

    hahaha ‘ex-NATO officer’ ‘did not reveal his sources’ That sounds real… how would he know anymore than you or I? Where are the clips …

    Ukraine losing 800 troops a day – ex-NATO officer

    Kiev’s manpower is “significantly worn out” as Russia’s “strategy of attrition” is taking effect, a former German Air Force Colonel has said

    Around 800 Ukrainian troops are being killed and wounded daily amid the conflict with Russia, retired German Air Force Colonel and prominent military analyst Ralph D. Thiele has claimed.

    In an opinion piece for Focus magazine on Wednesday, Thiele, who used to serve in the personal staff of NATO Supreme Allied Commander Europe, claimed that Kiev needs to recruit more than 20,000 soldiers every month in order to replace its dead and injured. He did not reveal his sources or basis for his calculations, however.

    800 x 365.. nearly 300k in a year… US lost 50k in 10+ years…

    According to the United Nations, Ukraine has a population of 36,744,636 as of 2023.

    The 1970 United States census, conducted by the Census Bureau, determined the resident population of the United States to be 203,392,031

    hahahahahaha… seriously???????

    Ya if I was a Ukey I’d just agree to walk into a meat grinder and die for the coke snorter… as if

    This is a f888ing joke… and so is this https://hackaday.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/indiamoon_feat.jpg

    But it’s on cnnbbc so it MUST be TRUE!!!

    https://www.tiktok.com/@tiktokrachelreenstra/video/7052092917552516398

  5. Fast Eddy says:

    Considering? hahahahaaha

    Report: US and its allies are considering a military attack on Houthis after rebels take over a cargo ship

    The United States and its allies are considering a military attack on the Houthi rebels in Yemen. This was reported on Wednesday night by the Bloomberg News outlet from sources involved in the preparations.

    According to the report, U.S. allies are already preparing plans to attack Houthi bases to stop the Houthis’ ability to harm merchant ships in the Red Sea and the Gulf of Aden.

    https://allisrael.com/report-us-and-its-allies-are-considering-a-military-attack-on-houthis-after-rebels-take-over-a-cargo-ship

    General F888-Face stated, “We would like to kill the Hooties… but they are really bad assed MOFOS… and our special forces guys are refusing to take them on … also we have very little ammo left and our ammo manufacturers are going bankrupt cuz we can’t afford their products anymore cuz the US govt is running up trillions in debt on useless stuff. We feel hamstrung and there is nothing we can do about these Hooties… they have unlimited ammo and high tech weapons. We are a paper tiger… we will just keep threatening them that if they don’t stop we’ll eventually come for them. But we won’t. We can’t”

    hahahahahahahahaahahahahahahahahahahaaaaaahaahaahahaha

  6. Pingback: Gail et Tverberg et la fin des combustibles fossiles (traduction de notre ami Stroberg) : tout va s’écrouler, accrochez-vous… »Les dictatures dirigées par des chefs au pouvoir absolu et les aristocraties dirigées par des chefs au

  7. Rodster says:

    Families that Inject COVID-19 mRNA Vaccines Together Have Heart Attacks, Blood Clots, Develop Turbo Cancer and Die Suddenly Together
    December 21, 2023 | Categories: Guest Contributions | Tags: | Print This Article Print This Article

    Families that Inject COVID-19 mRNA Vaccines Together Have Heart Attacks, Blood Clots, Develop Turbo Cancer and Die Suddenly Together

    Remember: it is just a coincidence.

    https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2023/12/21/families-that-inject-covid-19-mrna-vaccines-together-have-heart-attacks-blood-clots-develop-turbo-cancer-and-die-suddenly-together/

  8. MikeJones says:

    The ability to extract uranium from seawater could be a game changer for China’s energy structure. Photo: Weibo/CPNN
    ChinaScience
    How Chinese scientists are extracting uranium from seawater faster than ever
    Team’s electrochemical approach is at least three times faster than existing methods, study finds
    China is building more nuclear plants than any other country, but relies on imports to fuel them Science Zhang Tongin Beijing
    Published: 10:00am, 21 Dec, 2023

    Chinese scientists say they have found a way to efficiently extract uranium – the heavy metal used to fuel nuclear reactors – from seawater using electricity.

    The team from Northeast Normal University in Changchun, Jilin province developed an electrode to capture the uranium through electrochemical reactions.

    Moaron hopiem for the gullible moarons to believe all this gonna be rosy with BAU..

    • The idea of efficiently extracting lots of things has been around for a long time. The problem is “efficiency.” Usually, the cost turnout to be way to high.

  9. Wet My Beak says:

    In sad culture less new zealand the suicide season is upon us. A time when many trapped in this broken land reflect on their lives here and choose death as a better option.

    But a new danger has emerged.

    Hogs, otherwise known as new zealand women, who tip the scales at over 120kgs in most cases are attending office Xmas parties.

    Free alcohol and nibbles cannot be resisted by these porkies who become amorous on the booze.

    Now walking through the streets of any city here has a new danger. Drunk hogs attacking men. These gals are surprisingly nimble on their feet.

    Vouchsafe their grunts can be heard from a distance providing the possibility of escape.

  10. Pingback: Dix choses qui changent sans combustibles fossiles – par Gail Tverberg. Un texte important à lire et relire : « L’économie est extrêmement dépendante des combustibles fossiles. S’il n’y a pas assez de combustibles fossiles pour tout le mon

  11. https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/fed-backs-self-corner-just-inflation-revives

    Fed Backs Itself into Corner, Just as Inflation Revives

    Authored by Simon White, Bloomberg macro strategist,

    The magnitude of last week’s dovish swing by the Federal Reserve now makes a rate cut next year highly likely.

    Yet, as is so often the case with central banks focused on lagging variables, it could come at exactly the wrong time, with a profusion of indicators showing inflation will be rekindled later next year. Rate-cut expectations look overdone, but any repricing may not come until the whites of inflation’s eyes are seen — when that happens the move will be dramatic.

    No analogy is perfect.

    But history rhymes because there is one thing that is immutable through time: human nature.

    The 1970s were different to today in several respects, but the immutability of human behavior makes it quite conceivable a similar inflation pattern could recur.

    In that decade, price growth was a Three Act Play: Act I was inflation making new highs after excessive easing from the Fed; Act II was the premature all clear, with rates getting cut when it was thought inflation was beaten; and Act III was the re-acceleration, when price growth unexpectedly began to climb again.

    Article has several nice graphs. I think the author may be correct.

  12. Fast Eddy says:

    An economist who focuses on consumer spending has issued a dire warning about the U.S. economy in the coming year.

    “Since 2009, this has been 100 percent artificial, unprecedented money printing and deficits: $27 trillion over 15 years, to be exact,” economist Harry Dent told Fox Business on Dec. 19. “This is off the charts, 100 percent artificial, which means we’re in a dangerous state.

    “I think 2024 is going to be the biggest single crash year we’ll see in our lifetime.

    https://www.zerohedge.com/economics/charts-economist-claims-2024-will-bring-biggest-crash-our-lifetime-us

    • We talked about Harry Dent’s forecast recently.

      We can perhaps tie this in with the forecast from the Bloomberg economist that I mentioned above. It may be that the US cuts interest rates, perhaps in March, for example. Then inflation clearly rises again. The Federal Reserve feels it must really push up rates later in the year, and it is as interest rates rapidly rise that a crash occurs.

      • Sam says:

        Again there needs to be jobs to keep inflation up. Unemployment is rising velocity of money is going way down. Unless the government can do another 2 trillion stimulus is going to be a depression

        • Fast Eddy says:

          It’s worse than 2019 now…. we are building towards an explosive moment… and the CBs are very low on ammo ….

          They won’t allow that … they don’t want Hell’s Gates Opening

          1040 — there’s your answer https://drkevinstillwagon.substack.com/p/three-ways-mrna-shots-can-hurt-your

          Recall GVB said 40% mortality rate? That sounds about right … 40% if the Vaxxers die when they encounter The Pathogen … the rest are incredibly sick…

          Consider what impact that will have. There is no returning to normal – supply chains and financial system won’t exist

          Lockdown. Starve

  13. Fast Eddy says:

    I guess he’s ruined Christmas for his family….

    Irony alert! The establishment just lost another one of their own. Medscape ran the story yesterday headlined, “Renowned Cardiologist Jean-Philippe Collet Dies at 59.” Before he suddenly and unexpectedly died AT HOME on December 15th, Dr. Collet headed up cardiology at Pitié-Salpêtrière Hospital in Paris — one of the largest and most prestigious hospitals in Europe (founded in 1612). Collet was variously described as: a “renowned” myocarditis expert, a “powerful force in cardiology,” an “inspiration,” a “cutting-edge trailblazer,” a “prolific clinical researcher,” a “beloved doctor,” and even a “genius” — a true med/sci celebrity.

    Dr. Collet is survived by his wife, Hélène, and their children, Antoine, Alexis, and Olivier. We pray the survivors receive peace.

    https://www.coffeeandcovid.com/p/clustered-thursday-december-21-2023

    I think the most delightful SCHAD is experienced with the Vax Pushers… die.

  14. MikeJones says:

    Growing Old Could Have Played a Critical Role in Our Evolution
    NATURE 19 December 2023 ByDAVID NIELD
    https://www.sciencealert.com/growing-old-could-have-played-a-critical-role-in-our-evolution

    Growing old may come with more aches and pains attached, but new research suggests there’s a bigger picture to look at: by reaching our dotage, we might actually be helping the evolution of our species.

    Aging can have an evolutionary function if there is a selection for senescence,” says evolutionary biologist Eörs Szathmáry, from the HUN-REN Centre for Ecological Research. “We aimed to uncover this selection.”

    Such situations require strong directional selection, where evolutionary pressures (such as predators or environmental change) guide traits in a consistent direction; and significant kin selection, where genes have a higher chance of being passed on through the assistance of relatives.

    “For example, it is possible that in a changing environment, aging and death are more advantageous for individuals, because this way the competition, which hampers the survival and reproduction of the more adaptable progeny with better gene compositions, can be decreased,” says Szathmáry.

    In other words, natural aging and death leaves space for a new generation that just might have better combinations of genes.

    The researchers also suggest that having more generations sticking around through a drawn-out senescence in organisms that are strongly altruistic would be favored by kin selection. In other words those that help their relatives create a new generation have their long-aging genes passed on more often through them.

    ……While humans as a species might be obsessed with stopping aging, it seems that senescence has an important role to play in terms of evolutionary advantage – a role that experts are still trying to explore and understand.
    Tha you, Norm, or hanging in here and aiding our evolution….

    • There is definitely an older age bias in those people willing to consider the possibility of limits to a finite world. Young people are busy raising their own families, and the subject is terribly threatening to them.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        There is a correlation between having realized we were f789ed at a relative young age (45ish in my case)… and bucket listing intensively … and not really giving a f888 cuz been there done just about everything….

        I reckon 40-50 is the sweet spot… 25 would suck

        • Withnail says:

          and not really giving a f888 cuz been there done just about everything….

          What really is there to do? Everywhere is the same nowadays.

          • Fast Eddy says:

            Ever been to Uzbekistan? Or how about the aftermath of a quake in Haiti… or watching thousands of angry men chase thousands of Morsi supporters and beating those they caught… or how about being in the middle of hundreds of thousands throwing petrol bombs at cops … with the tear gas flying… and then there is a stay at one of the most remote Estancias in Patagonia… or an trip through the northwest passage….

            • Withnail says:

              None of that sounds worth leaving home for.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              I suppose if you enjoy going to places where everything is the same… then I could see how these adventures might not appeal

              That of course… is a good thing… otherwise…

            • MickN says:

              I agree Withnail – just stuff. Now this would be good-
              ” I’ve seen things you people wouldn’t believe. Attack ships on fire off the shoulder of Orion. I watched C-beams glitter in the dark near the Tannhauser gate. All those moments will be lost in time… like tears in rain… Time to die.”
              Not sure what it means but it’s just (science) fiction any way.

            • Withnail says:

              I suppose if you enjoy going to places where everything is the same… then I could see how these adventures might not appeal

              We have riots here in the UK. I don’t need to go abroad for that.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              Riots are fun … there’s a technique to watching … if they are moving North South … stay East or West… otherwise you’ll get caught up and possibly trampled or bashed …

              And be sure to wear some sort of helmet … this is ideal cuz of the visor

              https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/2119/4557/products/CCM-VR25-Straight-clear-hockey-referee-visor-certified_grande.jpg

        • MikeJones says:

          Eddie, you’re only mid 40s and wasting your life obsessed with collapse…I can see old farts like me doing it but a youngish sharp guy, like yourself,
          You’re going to look back and say
          My God, What have I’ve Done..
          Drumroll please Talking Heads…with TRUMP too funny

          https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=nSuregWhlWk&pp=ygUXbWFueSBhIGRheXMgZ28gYnkgdHJ1bXA%3D

          Trump as David Byrne

          • Fast Eddy says:

            I am 58 now … going on 12…

            The thing is … none of those years has been wasted… on the contrary … this knowledge has lead me to live life to the fullest…. in 2009 I walked away…. cuz I thought why am I tethered to this job??? F789 this … we are on the cusp of extinction and I am sitting here at a desk mining away… a few folks were like ‘what??? you are walking away.. are you insane?’ Of course the mine has never been as productive since… (you unplug the 1500HP and withdraw the High Octane fuel… and things slide)…

            But alas here we are …. as predicted… on the precipice… validating the decision….

            I just need to unload this Goat Ranch and get closer to civilization to see if there is time to get in some more bucket listing … before this f789er blows sky high.

            I am fully prepared psychologically for the Pathogen … mainly cuz unlike most… I didn’t waste the time since 08 believing there was a future when I’d do all the great things I wanted to do — then realize there is no future… only regrets about not doing this or that… nah – not me — I don’t give a f789 about the extinction … I am titillated thinking about it …

            Imagine being locked down as billions of MOREONS are dying cuz of their VAIDS infestation … sitting there … delighted knowing that these f789ing imb.eciles are drowning in pneumonia… now that is a pleasant thought…

            That will drive the arrogance of Fast Eddy through the roof … 1 … only 1 … out of 8B predicted this … only 1… The GOAT… think about that… this is a second coming kinda moment…. maybe it is

            • MikeJones says:

              Fascinating…how someone be so wrapped up ….unlike this young lad that lived an extraordinary brief life on a razors edge..not caring if anyone noticed at all..
              https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=jAtj0tyt52s&t=68s
              The Story Of Marc Andre – The Alpinist That Pushed The Boundaries Of Climbing
              Legendary alpinist Marc-Andre pushed the boundaries of climbing further than
              was ever thought possible before his life was tragically cut short.
              This is the story of his final climb.

              Ironic how he met his end playing it safe with a buddy and ropes…out of the blue an avalanche swept them under

              UNILAD Adventure

            • Fast Eddy says:

              I didn’t have a YT channel if that’s what you are getting at.. I seldom even take photos on these adventures.. definitely no selfie-stick

            • MikeJones says:

              My point is maybe you’re not aiming high enough …just kidding 😜
              As Clint Eastwood growled
              Don’t let the Old Man get in your way…
              According to the video, Eastwood and country-music singer Toby Keith were playing golf together at a Pebble Beach charity event two years ago. During the round of golf, Eastwood said to Keith: “I turn 88 on Monday.”

              Keith said, “What are you going to do?”

              Eastwood replied, “I am going to shoot a movie,” adding that filming was starting in two days.

              Keith said, “What keeps you going?”

              Eastwood replied, “I get up every day and don’t let the old man in.”

              Later that day at home, inspired by Eastwood’s relentless energy, Keith wrote a song, titled “Don’t Let The Old Man In.” He hoped Eastwood would like it. Not only did the actor like it, Eastwood felt he had a spot in the movie where the song would fit in.

              There you go…you got a lot of life ahead…Don’t let the collapse in your day

            • Fast Eddy says:

              it’s a mind set — supported by not allowing oneself to use the excuse of age to transform into an obese disease riddled heap of garbage…

              The thing is … most people begin that descent in their teens if not earlier these days… so they are f888ed by their mid 20s’.. pre-diabetic … and on the path to an early death.

              Weak as f888. Zero control. Can’t stop shoving KfC and Doritos into the maw…and suckling pepsi… pathetic

      • Student says:

        I completely agree, that’s maybe why the recent trend in western societies is to consider old people’s thoughts or suggestions completely unuseful, because they don’t understand the new ‘digital’ world…

    • ivanislav says:

      Stupid waste-of-space paper by do-nothing pseudo-scientists. Should read “scientists make a guess and do nothing legitimate to ascertain whether guess is right or not”. The entire argument folds when one considers we spent most of our evolutionary history not limited by competition *with one another* for natural resources, but simply scratching out an existence against nature itself. We weren’t limited by one another, but by our ability to extract necessities from nature. Ergo, aging wouldn’t free up limited resources for the young and no such argument is valid (i.e. a capable non-aging adult would still bring in net energy/resource surplus).

      Aging is predominantly genomic expression pattern instability. Larger organisms with longer evolutionary history (eg. crocodiles, sharks) have more stable genomic expression patterns and negligible aging. There are studies showing the two correlate strongly. Essentially, what has happened over time is that as they found a stable niche in the animal hierarchy and evolution of new features was disfavored and the genomic cruft was whittled away to leave a hyperspecialized energetically- and resource-efficient organism. Refinement beat continued evolution (the two are at odds, because the latter benefits from genomic dead weight that periodically gets recombined into the translated genome).

  15. MikeJones says:

    Bigger is Better, this ain’t about Rome
    Bloomberg
    https://www.mrt.com/business/oil/article/shale-bosses-brace-oil-megadeals-18566386.php

    Shale bosses are bracing for more megadeals in the US oil industry — and some fear the consequences of consolidation.

    Executives predict more monster acquisitions after Chevron Corp’s $53 billion takeover of Hess Corp. and Exxon Mobil Corp.’s purchase of Pioneer Natural Resources Co. for $59.5 billion in October, according to a quarterly survey by the Federal Reserve Bank of Dallas. For the companies that provide crews and equipment to oil producers, that’s not good news.

    “The consolidation of operators will impede the growth and sustainability of the oilfield service sector,” an unidentified respondent said in the report. “This will lead to the demise of small independent oil and gas operators, as they will be unable to obtain reasonable pricing from the few remaining service providers.”

    Oil prices will probably close 2024 at $78 a barrel, survey respondents said. That’s $10 less than the prediction for year-end 2023 in last quarter’s report. The market has been plagued by skepticism that OPEC+ will adhere to production cuts and concerns that supplies from the US are rising, though escalating geopolitical risks have recently introduced a premium.

    The policies of the administration continue to present significant headwinds especially for smaller independents,” one respondent said. “Access to capital is constrained for small projects less than $50 million in size.”

    • I would think that the big companies have some idea regarding how they might get additional value from these fields. Their overhead is likely higher, so that aspect wouldn’t be better. But if the higher overhead leads to improved technique, maybe some marginal areas may be made economic. We don’t know yet, however.

      Access to capital = borrowing capability. Also, no one wants to buy stock in a company likely to be a loser

  16. Agamemnon says:

    Part of what makes the U.S. crude surge surprising is that companies managed to increase production even as the number of drilling rigs at work fell roughly 20% this year. That productivity gain has confounded many analysts and researchers who have long relied on the rig count as a predictor of future crude output.

    https://worldoil.com/news/2023/12/18/u-s-shale-drillers-ramp-up-oil-production-calling-opec-strategy-into-question/

    Who cares? Ramps up depletion too.
    TPTB is a joke.
    This problem is well known but we allow SUVs pick up slurpees?

    (Gail, posts are no longer immediate, moderating must be a pain, maybe a WP login helps)

    • Fast Eddy says:

      Why would they tell us the truth — particularly if the situation is grim…

      See Jean Claude Juncker for a quote on that….

      It’s not that they want to lie… they MUST lie… because the MOREONS insist that they want the truth… but they actually don’t…

      The want the truth only if it involves a Hollywood ending.

    • There seems to be a huge efficiency gain:

      The company has reduced the time it takes to drill an average well by about 40% over the last three years, thanks in part to boring slightly smaller holes, adjusting the solution that’s pumped down shafts to power drills, and subtle refinements in the steel-and-polycrystalline-diamond-tipped bits.

      “In 2019, the average well took me 19.5 days,” Cho said during an interview afterward. “Now it takes me 11.5 days.”

      I haven’t made any recent changes to “moderation.” I am not sure I can fix the problem with posts not appearing immediately.

  17. Gail

    A superb series of lectures from the Altlanta Tech centre (something like that), called the Reith Lectures

    covering, debt prosperity etc

    i think you will enjoy them

    https://www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/m001thz1

    • Thanks! This is a lecture given at a university called Georgia Institute of Technology, or Georgia Tech. The lecturer is concerned about wage/wealth disparity. He is concerned that AI will make wage disparity worse.

      The count of students is confusing at Georgia Tech. It seems to have affiliate campuses around the world. It also seems to have more graduate students than undergraduates. There seem to be about 18,000 undergraduates at the Atlanta location.

      • “more graduate students than undergraduates”
        My impression is that that tendency keeps increasing for a couple of reasons: grad students are more likely to be foreigners, who are more likely to be paying full freight, leading institutions to cater to them where possible.

        Somewhat unrelated, I read a comment recently to the effect that colleges spend big on sports teams because a main source of donations are the well-off, largely male, alumni who continue to identify emotionally with the sports programs.

  18. MG says:

    This part of the article seems to be not correct:

    “Or they will huddle together with their dogs, as in the saying, three dog night, meaning a night that is cold enough to need to have three dogs to keep a person warm.”

    Sustaining the dogs requires meat, I expect a more plant based nutrition.

    • Cromagnon says:

      You can “expect” all you want.

      Only slave humans eat plants.

      Thats what agriculture is for.

      • Withnail says:

        1600 years ago the Huns rode through where MG lives.

      • People in good health eat plants, especially cooked plant items.

        • Cromagnon says:

          People in excellent health eat herbivorous animal fats…..cooking is somewhat optional.

          Dogs are an option as a treat…….they can keep up with the horses and they can eat a remarkable variety of things.

          Eat the laziest ones.

          • JesseJames says:

            There are 76 million dogs in the US. In my rural neck of the woods, they are a major problem. Everyone has dogs. When the crash happens, keep dog in mind for needed nutrition. Out of necessity you will have to deal with rogue packs that are dangerous and feral.
            People will let their dogs loose when they can no longer feed them.
            A good supply of traps, snares, 33 long rifle, etc. and you will not go hungry.
            dog soup, dog steak, you get the idea…

            • Withnail says:

              Eating dogs was popular in rural south Germany and Austria up until last century.

              Probably still is on the quiet.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              The dogs will feast on the dead bodies of the Vaxxers.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              76M… and there are apparently 200-300 cases of Lepto per year…. most of the variations can be easily treated with antibiotics…

              Therefore you are injecting your dog with sh8t that has some nasty side effects when his odds of dying from lepto are about the same as him winning the lotto… (I don’t think dogs are allowed to buy lotto tickets).

              https://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/read-this-before-you-vaccinate-for-lepto/

              There is a high rate of adverse effects from the lepto vaccine. Veterinarian Patricia Jordan DVM has documented several cases of tumors from the lepto vaccine, especially from combination vaccinations that include leptospirosis. Kidney failure is another common reaction, as you’ll see below. Bacterial vaccinations can also cause autoimmune disease.

              In the UK, where leptospirosis vaccination is quite common, Canine Health Concern conducted a survey and found that the vaccine can also cause the disease it’s meant to prevent.

              In that survey, 100% of dogs with leptospirosis caught it just after their lepto vaccinatons. Leptospirosis attacks the kidneys and kidney failure was a very common effect after lepto vaccination. Dr Jordan explains that the basement membrane can be damaged by clogging when the immune complexes drain via the lymphatics. The kidneys are a big part of the lymphatic system. The body tries to clear the toxins in the vaccines and the kidneys are damaged by this clearing mechanism.

              There’s a long list of other documented adverse effects from the lepto vaccine:

              Anaphlylaxis
              Anorexia
              Dermatitis
              Infection with flesh-eating bacteria
              Uncontrollable pruritis (itching)
              Vomiting
              Lethargy
              Lameness
              Vocalization
              Fever
              Dehydration
              Polyarthritis
              Kidney Failure
              Liver Failure
              Pancreatitis
              Mast cell disease
              Urinary tract infections
              Diarrhea
              Chronic weight loss
              Enlarged spleen
              Cancer
              Enlarged lymph nodes
              Death

              F888 ALL VAXXINES> F*** them

    • These folks who did this were hunter-gatherers. The dogs were likely hunting dogs. They were able to catch their own food, plus help get extra for their keepers.

      • Agamemnon says:

        Ahhh they created that surplus energy Norm talks about.

        • all species acquire surplus energy,

          its what they do with it that matters

          • MikeJones says:

            Our stray cats outside,who are very well fed many times, a day murdered two beautiful innocent squirrels in the backyard in one day.
            It’s just what they do..must be the fluffy perky tail twitching up and down they can’t resist.
            No justice in nature..

            • Squirrels are not innocent. Ever had one get into your house!? Ugh!

            • MikeJones says:

              Yes, I have, lived the sound of the little guys running up and down the rafters..
              Wasn’t too hard to get them out..
              Blocked their entrance with a screen and some goo gel

              They make great pets if you raise them as babies

  19. Student says:

    (Marittime Executive)

    Red Sea crisis, update.

    “Over 120 Boxships Affected by Red Sea Disruption.
    After a month of attacks by Yemen’s Houthi rebels, the number of boxships diverting away from the Red Sea-Suez Canal route is reaching epic proportions, according to freight forwarding insiders. This backbone of east-west trade is suddenly taking a back seat to the traditional route around the Cape of Good Hope, which adds 1,900 nautical miles and 10 days onto a typical Asia-North Europe container service. 
    According to top forwarder Kuehne+Nagel, there are about 120 container ships totaling 700,000 TEU taking the Cape route as of Wednesday morning.”

    https://maritime-executive.com/article/over-120-boxships-affected-by-red-sea-disruption

    • Lots of extra oil use (Probably diesel) used in this process.

    • moss says:

      The Red Sea comedy moves the the farcical middle part.
      John Helmer, on his front page at
      johnhelmer.org
      has the two top articles on the impact of the Red Sea militarisation. Of course the world knows that all risk to maritime traffic will cease immediately the Izzies get told to stop, now, permanently.
      Instead of the voicing that, Austin cranks up the volume.

      But get this: the oil in the Red Sea is now almost all of Russian origin passing west to east to India. It appears Chinese container carriers pass freely … Oil from the Persian Gulf to Europe? Problematic
      Yet more blowback for the EU and UK from their hegemon.

      Ozzie is contributing to Austin’s euroshot, six naval officers. Meaningless, other than to stir up animosity

  20. MikeJones says:

    Yo, Crybabies Doomers…yep that means you Nuttie, here is what COLLAPSE looks like
    WARNING for Americans‼️ This is what LIFE is like After an Economic Collapse
    TheModernSurvivalist

    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=ssU0WV7KFQQ

    I’ve lived in Paraguay and spent a lot of time in Argentina and Bolivia. One of the sadist things I’ve seen and that is very common is teenage girls selling themselves to buy food for their younger siblings. It’s either do that or starve. It’s heartbreaking.
    Yo, TROLL, this ain’t about Rome…I know, you think you know, about it all…

    • Withnail says:

      WARNING for Americans‼️ This is what LIFE is like After an Economic Collapse
      TheModernSurvivalist

      Nobody has yet seen what the economic collapse of the fossil fuel powered system will look like. It definitely isn’t this. Didn’t bother to watch the video.

      • MikeJones says:

        You took the bait…🙉 Get over it…🤪

        • Withnail says:

          oh no, i commented on a video. that must mean you win the imaginary game you’re playing. congratulations, my friend.

          • MikeJones says:

            Folks, …it’s already here in the USA…sorry, you don’t know and incorrect (again) it’s already started
            Here’s the proof…

            $750 a month was given to homeless people in California. What they reported spending it on is more evidence that universal basic income works.
            Natalie Musumeci Dec 20, 2023, 1:05 PM ET

            The study found that after six months, those who received the $750 monthly stipend were less likely to report being unsheltered and said they were closer to having enough money to meet all of their basic needs compared with a control group of people who accessed usual homeless services.

            Sure…whatshisname…the video I posted is all BS…enjoy your 750 stipend..see what that gets you…collapse is here

      • I will have to agree that garbage trucks will not be running for very long in a major collapse. This is what happen when there is great wage/wealth disparity in a fairly rich country.

    • The moderator, at the beginning, talks about too much socialism being part of what is behind the problem. Another video earlier talked about Argentina being a country that has had one collapse after another. The two could easily be related.

      The people are shown looking through the material garbage trucks bring back, looking for food.

      • MikeJones says:

        Thank you for taking the time in actually viewing the video of Ferfal as he’s called on his website…Surviving in Argentina.
        I posted the link a long while ago and he had to leave the country with his family over to Europe because of the harsh collapse there.
        Speaks from experience and provides great insight and tips to perhaps make it through the bottleneck.

        https://ferfal.blogspot.com/

        His blog is still up and has an index up to 2020…the index provides subject matter…looks as if he’s mainly a YouTuber.
        I bought one of his books and it’s a keeper

    • Sam says:

      It’s probably coming to Europe first…..

  21. I AM THE MOB says:

    Celion Deion has lost control over her muscles.

    Her doctor said, “Don’t worry, her heart will go on!”

    🙂

    Can’t leave em hangin!

  22. Fred says:

    FFS getting short? Two options:

    1. Put more solar panels on your roof and cans of diesel in your shed.

    2. Move to Russia.

    Unfortunately I’m too old for option 2 and anyway the kids won’t go with me, so option 1 it is.

    In the meantime party on doomers and enjoy Xmas whilst you still can. Who wants to wager we’ll still be BAU-partying-on next Xmas?

    Anyone planning to change their gender in 2024?

    • ivanislav says:

      Option 3: Invade Canada + Mordor economy. Trudeau has done such a nice job disenfranchising anyone with a spine that the truckers will welcome us and the rest will bulldozed.

    • Withnail says:

      Anyone planning to change their gender in 2024?

      Yes I am (not actually physically or anything). I feel like it’s a get out of jail free card should I do anything illegal in 2024, which of course I wouldn’t.

  23. nikoB says:

    A question to all the regulars and newbies too I guess.

    How do you read the comments of this blog?

    I just go to the comments section but it seems many of you use a different way- some with email (that doesn’t seem to go through for me, don’t know why).

    just interested

    niko

  24. Fast Eddy says:

    let me delight ya’ll – specially the ukers https://t.me/EdwardDowdReal/509

  25. Fast Eddy says:

    Police were called to Cable Beach, a popular tourist spot on Australia’s Indian Ocean coast, at about 8:40 a.m. The 55-year-old man was pulled from the water with serious injuries and treated by police before paramedics arrived. He died at the scene, police said.

    Police said later that they shot at the shark, which lingered close to the shore, for almost half an hour after the attack.

    https://www.rokna.net/Section-incident-188/630597-man-killed-in-shark-attack-in-western-australia-state

    Look at stooopid the humans are … why shoot at the shark?

    • Regarding the Bob Moran item, in some ways the vaccine scenario parallels what has happened with what I ran into talking to publishers about books mentioning overshoot and collapse. The publishers want to make it look like all problems are solvable, and that there will be plenty of jobs for students who later get jobs in the field finding these solutions. The education industry very much wants a “happy ever after” ending, and publishers want to make universities, faculty and students happy. So overshoot and collapse is removed from any discussion of what is ahead.

      The WolfStreet article is good, with lots of nice charts. At the end, it shows that the Northeast is showing the biggest drop in demand/prices.

      The article starts by showing that the 2023 peak in resale prices was below the 2022 peak in resale prices. New prices have been going down because of cost cutting approaches (smaller homes, fewer appliance included, etc.)

  26. Fast Eddy says:

    Very nice SCHAD here (for those who like to SCHAD)

    https://markcrispinmiller.substack.com/p/madonna-in-a-coma-celine-dion-has

  27. monk says:

    Really good article Gail! It seems so easy for many of our professional class to ignore the primacy of fossil fuels…

  28. Rodster says:

    “The Fed’s Empire of Speculation and the Echoes of 1929” by CHS

    https://www.oftwominds.com/blogdec23/echoes12-23.html

    This ties in with this blog post as to whether we are already in a depression?

    https://theeconomiccollapseblog.com/has-a-silent-depression-already-started-in-the-united-states/

    • I am afraid Charles Hugh Smith is right in his article, “The Fed’s Empire of Speculation and the Echoes of 1929.”

      Speculation has its own expiration dynamics, and they don’t depend on us recognizing speculative excess for what it is. They will unravel the excesses regardless of what we think, hope or deny.

      The Federal Reserve has so completely normalized speculative excess that these extremes are no longer even recognized as extremes. Rather, they are simply “the way the world works.” This Empire of Speculation is complex and plays out on multiple levels. . . .

      With the real economy’s productivity stagnating, the only way to get ahead is to join the crowd in the casino. Everybody’s playing, one way or another. In the 1929 analogy, every shoeshine boy and taxi driver was working a hot new speculation. Now it’s every Uber jockey and delivery driver. . .

      The 1970s offers a roadmap of how belief in the omnipotence of the Fed and the permanence of Bull Markets fades. Every rally is assumed to be a new Bull Market, and it takes repeated losses to empty out the casino.

      This goes with my view that the outcome will be hyperinflation rather than deflation. The Fed will keep trying to keep the market up and banks solvent, even if it makes no sense.

      The second article says that the cost of living is terrible.

      “If you look back to the Great Depression, the house was only three times the average salary. Now, it is eight times the average salary,” Smith said. “The car was 46% of the salary, the car today is 85% of the salary. And here’s the craziest part, the rent was 16% of the average salary, it is now 42% of the average salary.”

  29. Fast Eddy says:

    SOOOO eeeeee https://t.me/leaklive/17372

    How come … there is a massacre in Gaza… there are no terrorist responses anywhere?

    Wouldn’t you think sympathizers might skin alive a few JOOS…

    Probably cuz this is a simulation

    Same reason norm still thinks the Rat Juice is safe… it is not possible to change the simulation

    • JMS says:

      I expect you know that Terrorism (TM) is the ultimate psy-op.
      What governments and MSM call terrorists are nothing more than puppets manufactured and manipulated by the security services (TM).
      What is Hamas, for example, if not a useful bogeyman created by Israel?

    • drb753 says:

      Blocking all oil traffic through Suez not big enough for you? And this really hits the West, unlike stabbing two guys in a German shopping mall.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        How do you know it’s blocked?

        • drb753 says:

          It’s not blocked blocked. Global South ships still going through. There is a website where you can see it for yourself. marinetraffic.com. See how much thicker is the band rounding africa compared to the band going through suez?

          • Fast Eddy says:

            How do you know that is real? They faked the UKEY war…. they faked the India moon landing…

            How do you know that even if the ships are taking the long way around that this is being done for another reason … and that they are claiming it’s cuz some rag heads have disrupted one of the most important waterways in the world?

            Remember – they faked a war for the purpose of being able to blame Putin for raging energy inflation … to ensure that the MOREONS did not realize the inflation is related to severe depletion….

            How do you know anything? Specially when the men who run the world … use sophisticated fakery … remember – they faked the moon landings… they faked 911…and there is that India thing… oh and they lied about the JFK thing…

            You’d think that after catching them out so many times… people would question everything … but they don’t… just believe whatever bbccnn tells you – right?

            • drb753 says:

              Maybe we need Vandenbossche to start a maritime traffic site.

            • DB says:

              These are the important questions that we too often ignore. It often seems that many here rightfully believe that the media and governments lie about fossil fuels and green energy, but then rely on exactly those same sources for their beliefs about nearly everything else.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        It’s just under 200km long … https://earth.google.com/web/search/suez+canal/@31.15917735,32.32210122,9.40645933a,88409.97596109d,35y,0h,0t,0r/data=CnUaSxJFCiUweDE0ZjlhYWVlZjUyZDMzM2I6MHhhZGVjMWI3YTEyMjBhODQ2GWykth7Pjj5AIV7qMdtfK0BAKgpzdWV6IGNhbmFsGAEgASImCiQJudqgMCEEQMARua5YtKsEQMAZN3FvMvPwXEAhC2JnkTbwXEA

        It’s desert on either side for the most part for many km.

        Ya think such a critical waterway could not be protected by the US and NATO?

        They’ve have fighter jets and drones and 50 thousand soldiers combed either side killing anything that moves — if there was any threat to the oil coming through … they would scorch the earth…

        It amazes me that people refuse to question — lack common sense… well actually it doesn’t

        • drb753 says:

          right now the attacks are in the red sea, along the Yemen coast. I am sure you can defend the canal very well.

          • Fast Eddy says:

            yemen is a backwards shithole — been there done that…

            If they were attacking the oil supply chain… they’d be bombed into the stone age

            Given the implications of stopping the flow of oil — the US would stop at nothing to remove this threat — they’d return to the use of napalm and incinerate every square inch of territory where attacks were coming from

            Use common sense — this is not happening — it is FAKE

            Terrorism in general is fake – it is orchestrated… and it is very useful

        • Withnail says:

          Ya think such a critical waterway could not be protected by the US and NATO?

          Absolutely not without the full and active participation of Egypt and probably not even with that. We can’t afford such operations anyway.

          • Fast Eddy says:

            Last I looked Egypt was a vassal of the United States….

            Do we need to drop an Egypt Air plane… to get them onside? Do we need to tighten the screws on their foreign debt by driving up interest rates — and driving them into total destitution?

            Oh I think that Egypt would play ball with it’s master… it will run after the ball and bring it back to it’s master if asked.

            No way in hell this rag tag clowns shut down one of the most important waterways in the world… and threaten BAU…

            Have you seen anything on cnnbbc that indicates how the most powerful nation in the world is dealing with the shutdown of the canal? You don’t think they’d be reacting????

            You’d think folks would get it by now…. it is all fake.. all of it…

            https://hackaday.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/indiamoon_feat.jpg

            • Withnail says:

              Last I looked Egypt was a vassal of the United States….

              We’ll see. I think a lot of countries are starting to realise the US is much weaker than it seemed.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              The Elders still run the world… the only way that changes is if the financial system collapses… then there will be no world

            • drb753 says:

              Take it easy Eddy. The attacks are occurring 1500 km south of the canal. It’s like Kiev to Ankara. Different places, different climates, different waterways.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              And the US is not responding with a barrage of cruise missiles… even though the supply chain is under attack.

              Common sense has left the building

            • Withnail says:

              And the US is not responding with a barrage of cruise missiles…

              it can’t afford to waste them since it can replace them only very slowly, unlike China.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              hahahahaha… so the share price of arms makers is collapsing?

              https://duckduckgo.com/?q=raytheon+share+price&ia=web

              At what point does lack of common sense become mental illness (aka delusion)

            • Withnail says:

              hahahahaha… so the share price of arms makers is collapsing?

              what does the share price have to do with how many cruise missiles or shells can be produced each month?

            • Fast Eddy says:

              What does the share price of Apple have to do with how many phones they manufacture and sell each month?

              Wow. This is like trying to explain simple stuff to 5 year olds.

            • drb753 says:

              First, the Yemeni are no pussies. They have seen cruise missiles for 12 years now. Second, Larry Johnson explains how unmatched US fleets are to drone swarms (link below), and also that they are fighting away from US bases. Keep in mind that they only have to dent a few containers to cancel insurance policies. Try to grow up, the world is complex.

              https://www.unz.com/article/the-u-s-navy-is-unprepared-for-a-prolonged-war-with-yemen/

            • Fast Eddy says:

              hahahahahahaaha… ya don’t think they’d scorch the earth if anyone disrupted the flow of the blood to BAU???

              You don’t think they’d land hundreds of thousands of troops on either side of the canal and kill anything that moved?

              Ooooh ahhhh.. the Yemenis are so tough… hahahaha… I’ve been there — Yemeni men are addicted to Khat and walk around like zombies…

              You said the US was out of ammo — so then why would the share prices of the ammo makers not collapse? Where are the layoffs?

              Logic is not your strong suit

            • Withnail says:

              What does the share price of Apple have to do with how many phones they manufacture and sell each month?

              What does it have to do with it?

            • Fast Eddy says:

              No F for this .. we are gonna demote you to the winky class.

            • Withnail says:

              You said the US was out of ammo — so then why would the share prices of the ammo makers not collapse?

              There is only 1 artillery shell factory in the USA and it’s owned and run by the government.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              F. Fail

          • Foolish Fitz says:

            Even with Egypt on side they couldn’t. They have no nation with a Red Sea coast onboard.

            The Bab al-Mandab straits are 18 miles wide at their narrowest, with a two mile shipping lane.

            On one side you have the Houthis, that have been successfully practicing war for years. They make their own weapons and have just announced a voluntary call up which received tens of thousands of volunteers in the first day. They have a population of 32m and Iran would soon become involved. No Yankee tranny force is putting boots on their ground.

            On the other side you have Djibouti, with a Chinese Naval base and the Chinese are looking out at the geriatric, dementia riddled tranny force, thinking, dare ya.

            All tranny bases in the region have been facing non stop assault since October. They’re stressed and understand that if things escalate, the supplies dry up almost instantly.

            The Russian Pacific fleet is sailing in that direction also.

            The tranny coalition has just placed huge amounts of their fleets within easy reach and if they escalate, they might realise too late, that they are in a trap of their own making.

            There is no 100,000 boots to be put on the ground and no supply lines to attempt anything except a quick defeat.

            I’m amazed that Flatulent Eejits don’t know this, considering they talk about the obese trannies all the time. Anyone that believes they can just waltz in to Yemen, is just showing the world their sad racist Hollywood script were a brain should be.

            All European container and fuel shipping has ceased through the Red Sea. All Russian, Chinese, Iranian, Iraqi, Indian and many other non tranny nations are conducting business as usual. Operation Prosperity Guardian is looking like it’s going to be highly prosperous for some.

            Good luck trying to explain the resource issue, that would get multiple times worse the moment we escalated, to someone taught by the screen that all you need to do to win is be white. They can’t grasp anything that deviates from the standard Hollywood script.

            As moss points out above, Helmer gives some good detail.

            https://johnhelmer.net/running-the-red-gauntlet-russia-is-negotiating-with-the-houthis-for-red-sea-passage-of-oil-cargoes-defying-us-eu-sanctions/

            https://johnhelmer.net/breaking-news-chinese-iranian-and-indian-warships-are-now-in-the-red-sea-gulf-of-aden/

            • Withnail says:

              Anyone that believes they can just waltz in to Yemen, is just showing the world their sad racist Hollywood script were a brain should be.

              The moron you are talking about appears to be be mentally stuck in about 1991.

            • Foolish Fitz says:

              Maybe the war hardened Yemenis will run a mile, when the trannies swing their hand bags. It’s like talking to Ben Shapiro, they claim anything that suits their hollow argument as fact and anything that doesn’t as fake. No context and if you look back, quite often contradictory.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              Who needs to waltz in . if the backwards Hooties threatened BAU… they would nuke the country without a second thought…

            • Withnail says:

              . It’s like talking to Ben Shapiro, they claim anything that suits their hollow argument as fact and anything that doesn’t as fake. No context and if you look back, quite often contradictory.

              Entertaining at times but mostly a tedious loony.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              Recall after the invasion of Iraq how the place went haywire… the American forces ring fenced the oil — and let the Iraqi factions go nuts….

              Then when it was getting out of hand… it stopped.

              The US could have blown the f789 out of them and clubbed them into submission .. but that’s messy … what they did was buy off the honchos.

              If the Hooties were threatening BAU… the US would have the means to stop them.

              Israel owns Hamas…

            • Foolish Fitz says:

              Yes, thanks for the repetition of the script. Very helpful.

              In the meantime, Abdul Malik Al-Houthi has had a few words to say.

              “The thing that we want more, the thing that we have been wishing for from day one is for the between us and the Americans and Israelis to be a direct confrontation – not for the Americans to fight us through their collaborators.
              […]
              “At the same time, we ask all the Arab countries and all those who were mobilized by the Americans in the past to watch from the sidelines and let the Americans enter a direct war with us.
              […]
              “If they want to send their soldiers to Yemen, they should know full well that Allah willing, this would be a lot worse than what they faced in Afghanistan or what they suffered in Vietnam.
              […]
              “The Americans should not think that they can carry out a strike here and there, and then things will calm down, and they will be able to resort to some kind of mediation, in order to calm things down. If they get themselves in this, it will be an entanglement in the full sense of the word.”

              https://youtu.be/MIWRuA32k1k?feature=shared

              He’s thrown the gauntlet down, so isn’t this the point you go in, all guns blazing.

              It’ll all be over by Christmas

              How’s the worlds shiniest navy getting on.

              https://twitter.com/johnkonrad/status/1737956292436615453

            • Fast Eddy says:

              hahahaha… the big bad Hooties…

              this is all kabuki theatre… just like when biden shakes hands with ghosts…

              you are being played

              If the Hooties seriously were threatening BAU… they’d be nuked.

              The Elders would not hesitate if they felt under threat — if the oil stops 8B die

            • Foolish Fitz says:

              From boots on the ground, to drones and bombs, now nukes. Much like the words of the impotent bully, no one’s buying it.

              The U.S threatened.
              The Houthis said, come on then.
              Now the bully has to show, or it’s a bad look. A very bad look for a bully. Can’t be seen to back down and will need to be quick, as the coalition is whittling down extremely fast.

              A ship(with the wrong connections) was droned off the coast of India earlier. Long way for the Houthis, who else might it be?

              Twitchy sphincters for those now realising that they may have been manoeuvred into the position of sitting 🦆🦆🦆

              Hollow words, or action?
              Be seen as an impotent wind bag, or maybe wind up on the bottom of the sea?

              Not great choices.

              One hypothesis 👇

              https://tomluongo.me/2023/12/21/no-one-grokked-suez-houthi-gambit/

            • Fast Eddy says:

              Those Hooties are tough as nails! Pity that the US military with the trillion dollar budget can’t even keep the canal open… how the mighty have fallen

              hahahahahahahaha

              back to cnnbbc with you for more ‘talking points’

              And people think they should have a say in how the show is run … hahahaha.. gawd

              TFIs everywhere i look

            • Fast Eddy says:

              Can you check cnnbbc to see if there are any updates on this?

              https://hackaday.com/wp-content/uploads/2019/07/indiamoon_feat.jpg

            • Foolish Fitz says:

              Lots happening in the region. Sisi was on the phone to the President of Iran not long after securing victory in the election.
              The Houthis have agreed a tentative peace with the government(common enemy?).
              The Iranians have been integrating Russian Su-35 and Mi-28 attack helicopters into their air force.
              The Iraqis continue to keep U.S bases stressed and have attacked a port of the illegal encampment.
              Hezbollah Strikes are never ending.
              More ships are reported as attacked, but only those with dubious associations.
              The Elite Golani force(lions I’m told ) have been forced out of Gaza because of “unsustainable loses”.
              Female idf soldiers, guarding Palestinian men, have been removed from duty, for having sex with prisoners(something about real lions, is all that was heard).

              Looks like the French have been busy, with the bulk of Europe following close behind. Soon only a few countries will be left with precarious access through Bab al-Mandab.

              Helmer again does a decent summary.

              https://johnhelmer.net/honey-trap-for-israelis-and-americans-in-the-red-sea/

              Western corporations, backed the wrong side and are being financially slaughtered across the world and those people are unlikely to return to those businesses. A true mirror image of affairs in occupied Palestine.

              https://twitter.com/jacksonhinklle/status/1738587514301227193

              Death by a thousand self inflicted cuts gathers pace.

              Some cheer for the time of year.

              https://www.palestinechronicle.com/our-guards-in-gaza-protected-us-from-bombing-with-their-bodies-freed-israeli-captive/

              Those Palestinian men are making quite the impression.

              Prediction for 2024.

              Population boom in United Palestine 😂

              Enjoy your time with the future Gail.
              Enjoy your celebration, those of faith.
              Enjoy the day off, the rest of you and if you get bored, how about a game of Monopoly(guess who’s board).

              https://expressiveegg.substack.com/p/total-monopoly

  30. Fast Eddy says:

    Vet was trying to get me to shoot Hoolio with this shit https://www.dogsnaturallymagazine.com/leptospirosis-vaccine-side-effects/

    A friend just shot his dog and he’s feeling quite sick…

    Basically par for the course with vaccines — they generally do not work — they have brutal side effects –and the diseases they claim to stop – are usually easily treatable with antibiotics etc…

    Have you ever met a vax that a doctor or vet did not recommend???? Of course not — they make $$$$$$$ and they love $$$$$$

    • adonis says:

      doctors are all murderers hired assasins if they knew this theyd go mad

      • Fast Eddy says:

        When the time comes .. if there is opportunity… I’d like to get me a scalp of a doctor … or a vet.

        The opp may not come as we’ve structured something that has brought the buyer of the Goat Ranch back to the table — if that goes down then the guns and ammo will have to be abandoned cuz not easy to bring to Aussie if one lives in the city…. but no problem bringing my knives…

        https://youtu.be/KnWtd9DfkgY

    • JMS says:

      The fundamental lesson that the covid operation taught me was:
      Refuse. All. Medicines.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        F888 All Vaxxines. All of them.

        In the off chance there is any benefit then the MOREONS will take them and you benefit without the risks.

        F888 all MOREONS. They are Vaxxine Fodder

        Never try to turn a Vaxxer — it is not to your benefit — plus it’s a waste of time cuz they are MOREONS … encourage them to take every vax on offer… (like keith does)

      • Kowalainen says:

        Med grade opiates, anesthesia and acute surgery is the shiz when life throws you off the saddle and into the gnarl, breaking a bone or two in the process.

        • JMS says:

          No doubt that painkillers and antibiotics may be necessary, and that surgeries can save lives, but I was referring to drugs used to alleviate or hide symptoms in so-called chronic illnesses, which are actually lifestyle illnesses, and which therefore cannot be cured by chemicals. I will never take these drugs.

    • Ed says:

      I no longer vax my dogs.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        gotta have kennel cough to get into a kennel so might have to do that at some point

        • nikoB says:

          surely you will have to vax holio for everything if you are to bring him to oz

          • Fast Eddy says:

            Nope. He requires nothing other than an inspection within 5 days of departure. It would be different if he was coming from a country other than NZ.

            The other dog required a blood test cuz he was not born in NZ…. coming into NZ she had every vax under the sun … and had to quarantine 6 months in HK… then a month in Auckland before being released.

      • JMS says:

        Neither do I, although it is required by law here.

    • Student says:

      Dear Fast Eddy, I can tell you (and all of you) that I have very nice Labrador who is now 10 years old and she has unfortunately a blood cancer for which she is taking a kemyoterapic pill, thanks to which she is living relatevely good at the moment.
      Well, our Vet oncologist told us to avoid to give her any other vaccine, because it is dangerous to give vaccines to old dogs expecially with cancer (!!!).
      Of course the Vet suggested to avoid leaving the dog in the wild alone.
      You see? The politics of vaccinate fragile people and those who have cancer is difficult to deny that it is also a form of taking them out…

      • Fast Eddy says:

        I had our other dog in to get kennel cough vax… cuz she might have to spend some time in a kennel…

        I mentioned to him that vaccines do not have much impact on the elderly (she is 12) because of https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Immunosenescence He looked at me queerly … (either he wanted to fondle me or didn’t know the word)… and said … that’s something to take up with an immunologist…

        It’s like these people are in a box… they know what they know …. only what has been crammed down their throats… and nothing beyond that … they do not question or challenge anything…

        Make $$$ for themselves — make $$$$ for pharma… $$$-making machines…

        We have one of the munchkins home for the summer break — my project is to instil distrust of the medical industry… the other one is home for the Christmas break — he will get the crash course

    • I AM THE MOB says:

      The amount of meat pets consume is large enough to be the fifth largest country in the world.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        the meat is not the stuff that most people would eat…. + Hoolio and dogs in general deserve to eat more than humans do…..

        I would turn the tables and feed the dogs filet — and let the humans eat canned pet food.

        I don’t understand why humans believe it’s ok for them to get the best cuts… why?

    • The way the mRNA platform is supposed to work is fundamentally flawed. It leads to a large share of mis-reads of the RNA it is supposed to make.

      • Fred says:

        Hmm, not sure it’s “fundamentally flawed” Gail.

        It’s killed millions of people, f–d millions of others and made $billions for various oligarchs, so met its design brief doncha think?

  31. lrichards says:

    Gail, you’re a very knowledge expert on analysis of the problems, and it’s much appreciated, but while your listing the problems others are seeing the opportunities. That’s why your predictions will always be off the mark. Your like an engineer in the early 20th century listing all the reasons that the internal combustion machine won’t be practical for the general public (to dangerous, not compatible with the horse and carriage, need to repave all the roads, where do you store the fuel, traffic control signage on every street corner, not enough rubber supply in the world for the tires, too expensive, etc…..). Problems are opportunities. Things are never practical until they are.

    • You are right, at least to some extent. I always think that something bad will happen, and then the problem gets put off by something else. It could be a different financial gimmick. I would never guess that covid and its “vaccines” would be a temporary work-around that allowed more debt to hide our oil problem.

      There are always things going on behind the scenes that help things go a little better than we would expect. There are some new techniques that are at least marginally successful.

      At the same time, the situation looks awfully disturbing, looking from a lot of directions. It seems like something will go wrong, but so far things have held together marvelously well. If people like me weren’t pointing out the problems, perhaps others would not be working as hard on trying to find solutions.

      I have a little almost 2-year old grandson. I would like to see him live to maturity, too.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        I reckon the odds of that are lower than me winning the Lotto (and I don’t buy tickets)…

        I suppose it’s better to have lived a few years than none at all… provided the end game does not involve being skinned alive… fortunately the Elders are working on ensuring we all get to die without suffering too much

        And they hate Fauci… go figurer

    • Fast Eddy says:

      Are you practising your stand up comedy routine?

      I’d recommend you stick to your job as a pizza delivery boy…

    • Hubbs says:

      Speaking of ICEs, we may have reached the end of the road (pun intended) in practical advancements. For an example I have decided to hang on to my 2010 Lexus RX 350 with 156K miles rather than buy a new car. The reason, the new cars are crap! Government/environmental mandates have forced the manufacturers into making smaller engine displacement from normal aspirated V-8s and V-6s to four cylinders to squeeze out a few extra miles per gallon and which now require CVT (continous variable transmissions) with 8 speeds instead of three, and turbocharging which runs the energy hotter and early burn out with costly repairs. My three brothers are all mechanical engineers, one a former Ford employee, and the youngest still working in Stellantis in Michigan. How they rail against these mandates. And of course it goes double for these EVs. Total debt time and fire bombs. Essentially, these new CVT transmissions are “disposable” and the turbochargers burn out before 100K unless you drive like a granny. So no, I don’t think we have “innovated” in the past decade or two.

    • JMS says:

      “Problems are opportunities.”
      A broken leg is an opportunity to learn about the applications of plaster.
      Three days without eating are an opportunity to better appreciate Knut Hamsum’s “Hunger”.
      A shot to the head is an opportunity to find out whether or not there is life after death.
      Opportunities everywhere! We’ll never lose. Winners!

    • Zemi says:

      I think Gail’s estimate of the problems is quite conservative. She mentions only ten. I suspect that the eleventh problem was that she ran out of fingers and thumbs to count them on.

    • ivanislav says:

      Things are already falling apart in many countries. Look at Europe. Europe’s decline is buying us time, because they are using less energy, which frees it up and lowers prices for the rest of us.

    • Withnail says:

      Problems are opportunities. Things are never practical until they are.

      You’ll be reminded of that when you become an opportunity for the marauders once the power goes off and there are no more police. Hopefully they make it quick.

    • irichards

      all the problems to list from the 1900s required—for their solution—an energy resource that alreadly existed.

      the problems we have now require an energy resource that does not exist

    • Cromagnon says:

      Your point is taken but you are looking at healthy trees in a dying forest.

      We are actually in freefall right now. Global civilization was slowed markedly in 2008 (peak conventional)….it has flatlined in many metrics since then…..it is now in rapid decline (since 2019).

      I have always posited that once we went off the fossil fuel cliff then descent would be rapid (from a historical context) with the potential for complete implosion if we encountered an actual nuclear conflict.

      These are all internal failing of the structure of our complex civilization and are essentially unstoppable. The fact that most educated types cant really see that fact is built into our design both biologically and socially. In fact it is so ingrained that our species actually accelerate the process by allowing the narcissistic sociopaths control of the steering wheel just before we go off the cliff. Then once in freefall…..we look to the engineers to apply physical braking (horizontal fracking, weather modification, fusion power etc)

      Unfortunately for us however,….there are external forces at work also…….cataclysm (protocols of the simulacrum if you wish) and they are truly catastrophic (solar outbursts, meteors, volcanism etc).

      Our experiment is now ending……a few of our children will see the other side of this gaming protocol after having passed through the evolutionary filters built into the game.

      The rest of us get to move outside the construct to whatever that entails.

      Daniel Hoffman has it correct on the grand scale existence………and John Michael Greer has it correct on the inside the game itself.

      Gail seems to understand the game is somehow rigged.

  32. Fast Eddy says:

    Hey norm… I’ve put a word in with Santa asking him to deliver you enough IQ points so that you will be able to comprehend the humans cannot pass through the Van Allen Belts and therefore cannot land on the moon.

    • We will see what happens with the current attempt to go through the Van Allen Belt.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        I volunteer keith and norm to man the mission — walk the walk

        • There is a point in volunteering two of the older commenters. They wouldn’t be leaving small children behind, if something goes wrong.

          • Fast Eddy says:

            It would save me deleting their comments too… two birds one stone…

          • i realise that eddy’s life is subject to a lot of fakery, in anny number of respects.

            but anyone —given enough incentive—can fake one moon landing

            nobody ”fakes it” 6 times.

            • Jeffrey R Snyder says:

              Not sure I follow that since there has been like, what, 11 or 12 Star War franchise movies.

              If only Stanley Kubrick were alive to answer this question.

              Bigger question is, except for the hopium after-glow induced by patting ourselves on the back for of this supposed accomplishment whilst otherwise destroying the miraculous life on this planet, who cares and what does it matter?

            • Fast Eddy says:

              norm – you’ve just been informed that you are old and worthless.. that heaving you out of the life boat would be best for all …

              And that’s your rebuttal? hahahahahaha

            • hkeithhenson says:

              “nobody ”fakes it” 6 times.”

              The moon landing could not have been faked even once. There were something like half a million people involved. It is not possible to get that many people to keep a secret.

            • keith

              on the ”faking it” front—i was being generous to eddy’s fixation on fakes.

              i know, and you know, the moon shots were not faked–yet the nonsense persists–just like all the other fakerama

              when someone’s entire existence is predicated on literally everything being faked, for whatever reason, then there is a severe psychological problem somewhere.

              one can only sympathise until common sense prevails, if it ever does.—no point in getting annoyed at that which one cannot change.

              it is just a form of attention seeking—just as it was with Alex Jones—exactly the same thing, but Jones was on a larger and more dangerous scale—yet eddy repeated what Jones was vomiting out.
              ”look at me”—”look at me”—inferiority complex if there ever was one

              Take a look at Alex Jones in a physical sense…..there would be little alternative to ”faking it” with him .
              which is why i do not open eddylinks—ever

            • Tim Groves says:

              They might well have gone to the moon.

              Or they might well have faked it six times.

              I’ve head that some women fake it every Saturday night.

              Humans are very good at make believe.

              And this one will appeal to Keith—Humans are genetically selected for deception. The trait is ubiquitous. 🙂

              So I put it to you all again, in the faint hope that this time, one of you will give me a half-decent answer.

              What difference, at this point, does it make, whether they went to the moon or not? What did humanity gain from manned lunar missions that they couldn’t have gained by faking six missions and just staying in low earth orbit covering the windows to create a fake “view of the earth from half way to the moon”, which we have an official video of them doing?

              Also, can anyone debunk this evidence that Apollo 11 was traveling much to slowly after takeoff to have achieved the mission?

              https://www.aulis.com/apollo11saturn_v.htm

              I’m OK either way. Whether they went or whether they faked it, it won’t ruin my day or destroy my illusions. My self esteem and my identity don’t rest on the foundation of believing or denying the moon landings.

              Any takers?

              Keith?

              Norm?

            • Fast Eddy says:

              I’ve head that some women fake it every Saturday night.

              I know what you were thinking with that…

              SSS fakes it every time norm heads Out Back the Dumpster with his fresh diaper and loaded on pints… ooooh normie your the best out of 10,987 punters you are number one… and norm buys it every time — and leaves a few shillings tip… before staggering home … feeling the usual guilt and shame that is the aftermath of an encounter with that beastly fester…

            • my advice then is to avoid saturday nights tim—all day sundays is better anyway….screams of omigod might have somebody listening, unless he’s busy dealing with more important sins of course.

              but you are quite right in suggesting the apollo moon missions were little more than a vanity project

              had there been anything of commercial value on the moon, commercial interests would been established there within a decade—it doesnt seem to occur to anyone to consider that question

            • hkeithhenson says:

              “Any takers? ”

              All the moon landing locations have been examined from orbit, including the recent crashes.

            • Fast Eddy says:

              How did they pass through the Van Allen Belts?

              NASA says they are working on a craft that can fly through and allow the folks on board to survive… Orion Project look it up

      • hkeithhenson says:

        “current attempt”

        The Apollo missions went around the inner Van Allen belt. I have not looked, but I am fairly sure they will do the same this time. There is lots of explanation on the web.

        • Oh, well.. explanation on the web…

          Keith, how did they fit the moon buggy in the LEM, when they’re practically the same size? The whole thing is preposterous, and you know it.

          Who took the picture of Armstrong coming down the ladder?

          How did Nixon talk to them on the phone in real time?

          You must know it is all extremely silly.

          • Withnail says:

            The answers to all these Dunning Kruger questions are available online. Why don’t you look them up.

          • Fast Eddy says:

            keith is either Ai – or a complete f789ing id iot … or both

            Odd that this NASA engineer doesn’t say we’ll just go around them … he must also be a total f789ing idi ot as well…

            https://youtu.be/4O5dPsu66Kw?t=183

          • Fast Eddy says:

            There are so many Total F888ing ID-iots on OFW… TFI’s

            Let’s not forget that keith is shooting every booster offered to him…. you have to be a TFI to do that

          • hkeithhenson says:

            “Keith, how did they fit the moon buggy in the LEM, when they’re practically the same size?”

            Lidia, if you look there is most likely a video of the moon buggy being released from the outside of the LEM. I saw it in real time when it was done.

            “Who took the picture of Armstrong coming down the ladder?”

            No such pix exists.

            “How did Nixon talk to them on the phone in real time?”

            Radio, patched through mission control.

            “You must know it is all extremely silly.”

            For sure those who think humans didn’t land on the moon is silly.

  33. Dennis L. says:

    Merry Christmas to all, may Santa forget the lumps of coal.

    Dennis L.

    • Thanks very much.

      By the way, I will be flying to the Boston area December 26 to 29, but I will try to keep up with comments as best as I can during that time period. As many of you know, my daughter and family live in the Boston area. My little grandson is almost 2 years old–birthday January 12.

      • adonis says:

        yes merry Christmas gail enjoy your family time in boston and if you dont post as much well understand family comes first.

    • adonis says:

      merry Christmas Dennis

    • Merry Christmas Gail, Dennis, and everyone!

      I’ll be raising a glass of eggnog to ye.

  34. Fast Eddy says:

    Ya’ll trust the news? Really?

    The news insists we are transitioning to EVs and renewable energy… the authorities also agree with this

    But we know for a fact this is impossible. Absolutely impossible.

    They are not stooopid – they know this too — yet they insist.

    They are lying … they have their reasons – good reasons – of course they do.

    How do you know the UKEY war is real – how do you know they blew up Nordstream

    See the dilemma ….

  35. Student says:

    Hello Gail,
    there will surely be some other time to say it again, but it is the 20th of December and I would like to take the opportunity to wish you and all the readers Merry Christmas and Happy New Year!
    Many thanks for your contributes and for bearing my posts 🙂
    Buon Natale

  36. JMS says:

    A jumble of merry carols found at Megacancer.

    https://www.brighteon.com/55ca0dd1-df92-4574-b623-58e6e05455cf

  37. Diarm says:

    Here’s your pathogen FE..it’s built into the sauce causing a deattenuation of SARS cov2 back to it’s lethal peak fitness variant
    Omg this is exciting!

    https://nakedemperor.substack.com/p/latest-covid-smoking-gun-is-old-news?utm_source=%2Finbox&utm_medium=reader2

  38. A lot of hopium in the last few days .

    All of them can be summarized into one singe sentence : “I don’t want to die”.

    They are willing to grab any kind of straws falling into their hands,

    The latest, super duper projects are always ‘five years away’. We don’t know how the world will look like at the end of 2024, let alone 2029.

    An optimism ceases to be an optimism, but turns into delusion when it loses all sense of reality. Quite a lot of stuff here are just delusions to keep a person’s sanity.

    The truth is the BAU is a the end stage. Yes, the delusionists don’t want to believe it and will say whatever to drown their fears, since the reality is too harsh for them to swallow.

    We might have an Xmas next year, but it will be like the XMas in 1917 Germany. Victims of a war to make the lower classes of English speaking countries great again.

    • Dennis L. says:

      kul,

      I am living on borrowed time and I have never had any fear or regret. If you live your life reasonably well, do your best and basically attempt(note the word attempt) to follow the ten commandments, death is part of the life experience. That does not mean it is welcome, it is only inevitable.

      There is some pattern to the fabric of the universe, more and more scientists of all groups and mathematicians are coming to the conclusion there are just too many coincidences; not even the universe is big enough nor old enough to do it by random chance. My personal view is the universe and our part in it is a work in progress.

      You seem to be trying to control everything, God or whatever can only make things work well 20% of the time – a number which keeps coming up too often to be chance.

      Dennis L.

  39. Agamemnon says:

    I’m sure there’s plenty FF to bridge the gap to alternatives.
    Will it happen? No, because the trend is to limit FFs in any way possible.

    Interesting comment from
    G. MADDOUX @
    Peakoilbarrel:

    …Appalachian Basin. Most of that has to do with a massive rift, creating a complicated, splintered graben due to multiple fault lines, allowing a large horizontal section of the crust to depress downward, with an almost unheard of amount of hydrocarbon dense rock lying in laminated, normally fractured sheets like drywall plaster. What this means is that Devonian shale in the right circumstances might serve as both source rocks and oil and gas traps (seals) for a very long time.
    …….
    This thing that I’ve just described has been named the Rome Trough, and it’s not just any old valley. Grabens tend to be places where great minerals, rare earth elements, and porous hydrocarbon rocks are found. In this case, wells on the edge of the Rome Trough may become legendary and the AB could become the granddaddy of them all. It comes with a plus, in that a relatively high percentage of NG in that area is ethane, from which polyethelene is made, and as it turns out most of the polyethelene in the United States is manufactured nearby.

    I believe the Appalachian Basin in its entire length could serve NG to our country for as long as we need it. In the USA, it is unique and magnificent. It has been lost in the mechanics of the other shale basins. There are other grabens in the USA (Lake Tahoe sits in one–that’s what ushered in the Gold Rush), but nothing quite like this one. I would imagine that Coffeeguyzz can jump in here and enlarge on this a great deal. As grids begin to go black, the AB is going to become a savior–in my opinion. And while I love the USGS, I don’t think they have an idea of the extent of this giant basin.

    • Perhaps. I will have to admit that natural gas production in West Virginia has been doing very well.
      https://www.eia.gov/dnav/ng/hist/n9010wv2m.htm

      Natural gas in Pennsylvania looks to be stalling out recently.
      https://www.eia.gov/dnav/ng/hist/n9010pa2m.htm

      There may well be other states whose supply can be tapped. Natural gas seems to be quite abundant, if companies can go to the expense of extracting it and building pipelines for it. There generally needs to be some separation of unwanted pollutants, as well. The price of natural gas tends to be very low, making some of these operations not economic.

    • Also, the US may divide into pieces, and the parts with natural gas may encourage its extraction. In fact, if there is a war, I would expect the parts with natural gas to beat those without.

  40. raviuppal4 says:

    Ze will own nothing and ze shall be happy — Klaus Schwab
    https://mishtalk.com/economics/u-s-steel-bought-by-a-japanese-company-thank-tariffs/

  41. MikeJones says:

    Who’s gonna pay for all this?
    After a Decade of Planning, New York City Is Raising Its Shoreline
    Inspired by the Dutch model of living with water, New York’s coastal defenses are on the rise. The city — like others around the country — is combining infrastructure like floodwalls with nature-based features, as it moves ahead with the largest resiliency project in the U.S.

    BY ANDREW S. LEWIS • DECEMBER 19, 2023
    The BIG U was conceived in the aftermath of 2012’s Superstorm Sandy, which flooded 17 percent of New York City and caused $19 billion in damage. Like Hurricane Katrina in 2005, Sandy helped push New York and other flood-prone coastal U.S. cities — among them Boston, Norfolk, Charleston, Miami, and San Francisco — toward embracing the Dutch concept of “living with water,” which emphasizes building infrastructure that can both repel and absorb water while also providing recreational and open space.
    The Asser Levy renovation, completed in 2022, is part of East Side Coastal Resiliency (ESCR), the largest urban resiliency project currently underway in the United States. Over the next three years, at a total cost of $1.8 billion, ESCR will reshape two-and-a-half miles of Lower Manhattan’s shoreline. But ESCR is just one link in a much larger, $2.7 billion initiative called the BIG U — a series of contiguous flood resilience projects that runs from Asser Levy, near 25th Street, around the southern tip of Manhattan, and up to Battery Park City, along the Hudson River. When finished, the BIG U will amount to 5.5 miles of new park space specifically designed to protect over 60,000 residents and billions of dollars in real estate against sea level rise and storm surges.

    Add this to other coastal cities like Miami, Boston ect and we got some bills coming

    • JesseJames says:

      All paid for with printed fiat money that is rapidly suffering inflation.
      These grandiose projects will suffer the same fate that Biden’s green offshore wind projects suffered…CANCELLATION due to rising costs.

    • I am sure that, to the extent these get built, they will be funded by debt. But the debt doesn’t allow any increase in consumer goods for sale to the public. It just means more debt, quite possibly at a higher interest rate. It pushes the debt bubble toward collapse.

  42. MikeJones says:

    To much…but not really if your rich and a moaron…
    https://www.businessinsider.com/tesla-owner-repair-bill-day-after-buying-suspension-issue-report-2023-12?amp
    Tesla owner says he got a $14,000 repair bill one day after buying a Model Y. A new report suggests it’s part of a much bigger problem.
    A Tesla owner walked away with a $14,000 repair bill from a day-one issue with his Model Y.
    The Model Y’s suspension broke with only 115 miles on the odometer, according to a report.
    Reuters found that Tesla has faced thousands of complaints over suspension and steering issues.
    Jain told Reuters part of his EV’s suspension broke when he was driving with his family the day after he’d received delivery of the Model Y. The car had 115 miles on its odometer when the suspension issue caused portions of the vehicle to come in contact with the road and Jain to lose steering capabilities, according to the report.

    The Reuters investigation — which cites interviews with over 20 customers and 9 Tesla workers, as well as thousands of internal documents — found that Jain was one of thousands of Tesla owners to face issues with the company’s suspension or steering over the past six years. The publication reported that while Tesla has publicly denied some of the issues and allegedly attempted to put the onus on owners, the automaker has been more aware of the issues than it has indicated publicly.

    I see a bright future ahead for the EV market…at least for the repair department

    • Back in my Oil Drum days, I remember being told how trouble free EVs would be. They have fewer moving parts, so what could possibly go wrong?

    • Rodster says:

      Was this not covered by the vehicles warranty? Just wait for the owner to find out the price to replace the battery module, ouch!

      • Fast Eddy says:

        This is almost as good as a Vaxxer going down with a severe injury hahaha

        The opportunities for SCHAD are endless as we circle the drain

        These EV owners are so f789ing stoooopid that they cannot understand why their bank accounts are draining them into bankruptcy hahaha

        Did you see the one from the EV MOREON in the UK who took out a personal loan for 5000 pounds… to pay his insurance hahahahaha… of course he doesn’t have any cash on hand to pay it cuz he got played and spent it all on the contraption

        haha… f789 him…. f789 all of them … they mocked anyone who dared suggest we have not been to the moon… well if they would have listened they might have realized everything is a lie and they’d not be dying and bankrupt hahahaha

        Too good to be true! (oh right it is – we starve)

  43. Fast Eddy says:

    They are moving on … from one fake story to various new ones

    https://www.zerohedge.com/political/war-ukraine-tab-quietly-removed-washington-posts-homepage

    Feel free to continue believing though…

  44. Fast Eddy says:

    https://drpanda.substack.com/p/celine-dion-is-covid-19-vaccine-injured

    That said … we see that Adam B was threatened

    https://live2fightanotherday.substack.com/p/darwinian-system-with-covidian-jab

    What might they be saying to the celebs and athletes to ensure they remain silent?

  45. Fast Eddy says:

    How good is this /// she’s getting worse!!!

    And still she says nothing …

    https://drpanda.substack.com/p/celine-dion-is-covid-19-vaccine-injured

    • Rodster says:

      “And still she says nothing … ”

      She won’t because she now gets sympathy. Admitting and going public with a vax injury would turn those same individuals against her. I have NO doubt she has connected the dots like so many others. That’s why, I have NO sympathy for people like that when they promote and encourage others to take a product that even Albert Bourla doesn’t want to take.

      As the classic line from Jerry McGuire said: SHOW ME THE MONEY!!!!!!!!!

      • Kowalainen says:

        This reminds me of that old Cher song “turn back time”. I reckon bitching and moaning about her possible vax injury won’t make much of a difference.

        I’m waiting for the “sacrifice” spin: “I injured myself cuz save mankind” schtick. When in reality it was a purely egotistic and conformist decision: “I don’t wanna get ill, and the herd is unrelentingly coercive”.

        https://youtu.be/9n3A_-HRFfc?si=0DnaCZitNj_F2TBX

        But you surely understand that which ruminates in the emptiness between those two deaf ears and myopic eyes.

        Oh yes.

        • Fast Eddy says:

          maybe she could write a song about this — oh right she doesn’t write songs … none of them do … they are karaoke singers who are handed the music

          much like a news presenter… they are not journalists they are presenters … readers

          twats

          And norm trusts them hahaha… norm been played

          • Kowalainen says:

            I reckon Normal wants to be played, as it supplies reassurance in an uncertain world. The puppet masters plays Normal as it gives them a sense of certainty in control of the Rapacious Primates.

            However, there’s only one effective way of controlling the loonies, yes indeed: Bread and Circuses. Placate their hunger. Feed the beast. All their little perversions and filth. And it seems to work wonders. Asocial media is such a blessing, an amplifier of a species default mental illness.

            WITHIN TEMPTATION IS THE TRUTH!
            OF A DERELICT SPECIES!
            OF A DEFUNCT SPECIES!

            🤣👍👍

            • Fast Eddy says:

              yes – just like a dog…. he’ll do all sorts of tricks … for treats…. humans are absolutely no different…

              The Elders understand this … it’s how they control the world… treats.

      • Fast Eddy says:

        Albert also pretty much said he was threatened to agree to front for the Rat Juice.

Comments are closed.